Nukeproof Scout Review (2022 Gen 3 )
Pros and Cons
Pros:
Cons:
- Still a good value
- All parts swap over from previous scout (and other Nukeproof models)
- Excellent cable routing
- Not extremely modern or extremely outdated geometry
- Happy on most trails
- Threaded BB
- External Cable Routing (except for the dropper, of course)
Cons:
- Not as great a value as prior models
- Stiff riding frame
- Vanilla ride
- Could use a longer reach
- Not very playful
Who it's for:
- people looking for an all-rounder that's up for anything
- people who are on a tight budget but still want modern components
- people who want to get the most bang for their buck
- heavier riders who don't want a flexy frame
Who it's NOT for
- xc racers
- enduro shredders
- riders under 160 lbs due to its stiff ride
- people who are looking for a bike with a ride feel that really stands out from the crowd
My full thoughts on the 2022 Nukeproof Scout Hardtail
today we're comparing the stanton sherpa gen 3 steel versus titanium and seeing how they ride back to back
in an ideal world i'd have enough of the same exact parts to build two of these up at once but i don't so we're gonna do the next best thing so we're gonna go take this for a ride on a trail i'm gonna run back to my shop put all the exact same parts on the tie frame and then same day go out and ride the same exact loop so it's still fresh in my mind so i can compare how the two feel it's not scientific but it's the best that i can do and i've been able to feel the difference back to back on other bikes hopefully i do on this as well i've previously reviewed this bike with 27.5 plus wheels on it but for today's ride i've made a few changes i've got 29ers on it i got my paul clamper mechanical disc brakes on here i've got my nuke proof horizon v3 29er wheels with specialized eliminator grid trail t7s up front in a 2.3 and specialized ground control grid in a 2 3 in the rear as well i like two threes more than two sixes i feel like they dig and bite and are a little more precise and and give the bike a snappier feel and a less vague feel i feel like if you're going to go plus go plus and go 2.8 to 3.0 let's get riding i'm glad i went with the 35 mil riser bars i like a taller stack some people like a more aggressive lower front end and for those of you that do you'd like less rise in your bars but this feels good for me with the 120 mil fork this bike has a super comfortable pedaling position i feel like stanton really knows their stuff keeping the reach compact on this bike for its intended use that makes a lot of sense i've had it on double black diamonds and it got a little out of its comfort zone especially on ledgie drops but for green and blue and black trails i think the geo's really good as i said in my other review this is my favorite riding steel frame i've ever ridden it's just a reminder that not all steel bites have to be over built burly enduro shredders restores my faith in bike builders they can still make light fun comfortable steel bikes and that's what this is this is such a good climber doesn't feel heavy my body's in a comfortable position i feel like i could ride all day like this what a fun riding experience what a beautiful day it's a joy to climb on this thing does not feel heavy in the slightest doesn't feel like my spot rocker that's super light but it doesn't feel heavy either surprisingly this bike rides equally well with 29ers or 27.5 plus a little quicker on 29ers overall speed wants to keep its momentum up but the geo doesn't feel like it's suited for one more than the other it's pretty middle of the road so if i were bike packing this i'd either throw 29 by two sixes on or 27.5 by 3.0 for trail riding i think it suits itself best as a 29er if you like higher speeds and you kind of want an xc race feel if you want to play around in monster truck and ride stuff that's a little bit gnarlier than it's intended for an underbike i think the 27.5 by 3.0 is the way to go but steering's calm with both cornering is great with both you can really run either one and for those wanting a mullet setup sure you could do it i don't think this is the right bike i feel like mullets really shine on fast downhill bikes i feel like if you want to maximize a mullet i'd get the stanton switch niner and mullet that and maybe run a 130 fork i'll bet that'd be really fun but do whatever you want you can always mull it any 29er bike it'll lower the bottom bracket a little make it a little slacker but with the range and bikes we've got right now where some bikes have a 30 mil bottom bracket drop and some have an 80. you don't need anything special to mull it just do it and experiment and see what you like and don't like borrow a buddies wheels and throw them on we don't have a lot of flow trails in sedona but this is one of them long canyon the dead man's this is dead man's right here
this bike is surprisingly playful when you've got a shorter reach you can get away with a longer chain stay to still have fun
a little bit slipperier out here today we got some fun trail conditions a lot of loose sand
this bike can charge pretty well though man it's comfortable
just real fun on greens and blues love this steel frame if i didn't know a tie frame existed i'd be thrilled with this but we always want better don't we and even knowing the tie frame exists i'd still be thrilled with this bike but i'm excited to see if i can feel that 1.7 pound difference between the two and if there's a different ride quality geo's exactly the same between the two
yeah i think 120 mil travel is perfect on this bike
and a lot of people are asking how does the fox step caps compare to the sid they're both fine the fox has a little more room for 27.5 plus that's why i have it on here i'd be just fine with either one so that was fun real comfortable a lot of people are in denial and think there's no such difference between a stiff hard tail and a harsh one because they don't want to hear that their model's harsh there's a huge difference and this is one of the most comfortable steel frames i've ever ridden it does beat out that johnny rotten i rode so many years ago all right now we come to the technical climbing section of this trail so as you know it's not my first choice for charging super big moves like where i broke my pinky let's see how it does with medium tech moves up here
here's the first one
didn't time that perfectly it worked normally i like a steeper seat tube and a longer reach but if it's going to have a shorter reach like this i like a slacker steep tube just like this and it works well
and i know that stanton knows their stuff oh i gotta concentrate here
redo don't judge the bike i was in the wrong gear
picked a better line oh yeah no problem it's a good comfy climber i think i'd keep 29ers on it almost all the time for how i'd intend to ride it it's kind of like a steel version of my spot rocker but the spot is noticeably lighter it accelerates faster
they're about the same comfort level but if you don't want a carbon frame or you want a bike pack and strap bags to it i think this is a great option be interesting to see how the taiwan one compares to the reynolds eight five three one i'll bet they'd be more similar than different dan says the weight is pretty similar so how does this bike compare to other bikes in the same category xc slash trail bikes it's not as fast and energetic as the spot rocker there's a little bit more excitement to the ride on the rocker this is a little bit more common subdued i think this is the bike that most people who've been riding older bikes it's the most modern bike that they'll feel comfortable on without having to change much in their riding style surprisingly i like this more than some tie frames i like it more than the sage power line it's not quite as zippy and snappy and light feeling but it is more comfortable it feels a lot like my rsd middle child tie it's maybe even slightly softer the geo's very different from the middle child though middle child's much more of a bruiser attack charger enduro double black diamond type bike i like this a lot more than the nine or sir nine it's more supple than the niner more modern riding position less twitchy old school xc racers are gonna like the niner a little more because this is slacker than the niner this would be a great bike for someone with a full suspension for big days but then they want a fun comfortable little bike for the green and blue trails near them or for bike packing i prefer this bike over the sage flow motion though they have different intentions
i feel like i can actually ride this about as aggressively as the sage flow motion despite being less travel and a little bit less aggressive geo on paper oh i do struggle on these big power moves on this bike with that shorter reach i do not feel hunched over which i really like i think if this was my only bike i'd get used to it more and be able to climb techy climbs better look at these beautiful green ocotillo such a smooth quiet bike
your weight's really balanced between front and back on this thing you don't have to get over the front so much because you're already over it because it's a little shorter
oh almost crashed
i still have a broken finger the doctor said i can ride i'm just not allowed to crash so i'm taking it easy so i want to be real clear i'm comparing one steel frame to one tie frame we can't assume that every tie frame and every steel frame will compare like these two do so much goes into a frame more than the material and i'm always reluctant to make these videos because someone's gonna come away from it and say oh i can buy a chinese frame for 1200 bucks at titanium it's gonna ride better than every steel frame or vice versa we don't know that gotta factor in tubing thickness and size and junctions and geometry there's so much at play here so be very careful with over generalizations that said i'm super grateful for stanton for sending these in for this experiment i can't wait this bike and the spot rocker are two of my favorites for flow trails if you want to see what steel is reel is all about to see if you can feel the difference between steel hardtails this is the one to do it on some steel bikes ride harsher than aluminum this bike has that famous steel is real feel it's amazing how good it feels and it's amazing how bad some other steel frames feel this bike is such a great bike for just putting down the miles i like it with 29ers feels a little more efficient feels a little more playful and rowdy with 27.5 plus but yeah even with two three tires it's a comfy frame i know i keep saying that but it's significantly more comfortable than most steel bikes more comfy than the nimble9 much more comfy than the rsd middle child steel or rc291 and it should be it's got a different intention not meant for hucking or rowdy big stuff so it can be built a little lighter because it doesn't have to endure the massive forces you'd see on an enduro bike which gives it that nice nice feel feels a lot like that johnny rotten but with better geo much slacker head angle you can attack stuff way harder see i even know this is a little shorter reach it's more aggressive than a chameleon i feel like i can ride it harder than a chameleon i feel like the chameleon's a little zippier a little quicker on the acceleration
oh what a joy this bike loves to pedal it's so happy when you're pedaling
it also loves to fly down stuff way faster than you think it should
all right let's wrap this up as you know i love the feel of this bike it feels amazing feels better than a lot of thai bikes i've been on now i'm headed to the shop i'm going to swap every single part on this straight onto the tie one come back out here in a couple hours and ride the same exact loop and explain the differences in the ride feel hopefully that gave you a great baseline of what this amazing bike is like the thai bike has some big shoes to fill and it's going to be real hard to beat this ride quality but if it has the same ride quality and it's lighter that's going to be pretty special all right it's been a few hours and we're back with the stanton sherpa tie so everything swapped over identical except for the seat post this has the larger seat post the steel one just has the 30.9 this is the 31.6 i think it is so i had to swap seat posts that's the only thing that's different and even though the frame was 1.69 pounds lighter the complete bike was only 1.3 pounds lighter i don't know where i lost that other 0.39 pounds one thing i forgot to mention in my first look video where i compare this to the steel frame i messed up this is not a uk tie frame i thought it was they made about a hundred of them and then they decided to move production to taiwan so that they could get the quality and the speed and the quantity that they needed there's a lot of demand for these and they couldn't keep up with it in the uk so this frame i emailed dan and said dan do i have a taiwan one or a uk one and we checked the serial number and he said you have a taiwan one that could be why the welds look so amazing this is built by one of the best builders in the world who's in taiwan there's a couple other companies that have some great builders in taiwan and i've been very very impressed with them it's still built to stanton's tubing parameters and specs and angles and all that it's just not stanton doing the welding so i'm actually excited that my version is the same one that you'll get if you get a tie one so two more things i need to point out on the difference between the steel and the tie one on the thai ones we've got these little ports that have the bolt and they come in on the bottom of the down tube on the steel one it comes in the top and it's just a little hole and we feed it through and they still pop out down here in the same place but they enter in a different place personally i like the steel routing more that because this is going to rub the crown of my fork what i'd really love is a little window right here to run it in the side because then my cable routing would be nice and pretty and go in the side one other thing you'll notice this has a front derailleur cable hanger in case you wanted to run one apart from that they're pretty much identical other than where they're welded so you know i love the mint green one but dang this is amazing stanton anodized their logo there before bead blasting it it looks absolutely amazing this is probably the most beautiful tie bike i've ever ridden let's see how it rides that's really all that matters who cares how pretty it is if it doesn't ride great judging by the other stands i've ridden i think this is going to be pretty cool so i'm going to ride the same exact route i rode earlier this morning on the steel one maybe it's the extra chain lube i put on maybe i put on 0.39 pounds of chain lube that would be a lot 1.3 pounds is noticeable although i will say running super light wheels would make more of a difference than a super light frame on the climbs this frame feels a little snappier i don't know if it's stiffer or just because it's lighter it accelerates faster it's a little more energetic a little less laid back a little bit racier feeling feels like i can push one gear harder at the same effort of the other one yeah this bike wants to attack a little bit more i think it might be stiffer we'll have to see on the downhill under sprinting it does feel slightly stiffer which is when you want a stiff bike when you're putting power down reminds me a little bit more of the spot rocker with that little bit um with that little snappier acceleration i like it yeah i should be more tired because this is my second ride of the day but i actually feel good and a little more energetic i'm willing to push it a little more interesting the other one didn't feel slow at all this one just has a snappier feel oh man i can't believe we're here already that climb went by really fast i'm impressed with these clampers on here and these wheels i added a good amount of weight to the bike coming in about 27 and a half pounds so that was pretty interesting and unexpected i did not expect it to feel zippier i expected it to feel a little lighter but not it almost felt more efficient almost like under sprinting it delivered power a little bit better and didn't flex quite as much the other one wasn't a noodle at all and maybe it's just the weight thing but it's hotter i'm more tired it's been a longer day i've been working all day i shouldn't feel more energetic yet here i am and while 1.3 pounds is noticeable it's not like night and day so i'm thinking it might have something more to do with the stiffness of the frame let's find out though we're about to take it on some downhill fun flow then some more technical climbs see what it feels like as i ride it so this is just seed of the pants this is not scientific
even though these paul clampers are a little heavier man i'll take that weight i love these things got them on three of my bikes now i bought two more sets myself after my review set i love them sounds a really nice quiet ride it is a little stiffer i did not expect that my broken finger a little more sensitive to jar jarring stuff howdy ooh very interesting yeah the rear triangle just feels slightly stiffer the front as well i get a little more vibration this feels a lot like my banshee paradox
stiffness wise
yeah my broken fingers feeling that that's really interesting all right that's so funny because on the rsd middle child the tie frame is way more supple than the steel one and on this bike the steel one feels more supple than this thai one this is still a great bike and i think if i were racing xc or long distance i think this would be a great one for bike packing it's probably a wash because once you load this up with 20 pounds of gear it's going to ride supple like the steel one oh now i'm curious to try a taiwan 4131 versus the reynolds 853 and see if the reynolds really makes a difference wow this is totally not what i was expecting i was expecting ride field to be pretty much the same as the steel all right technical climb challenge
it gets out of its own way a little bit quicker and i honestly think it's more the stiffness than the weight
and i want to be real careful you don't misunderstand stiffness this feels like a big owl or my paradox or santa cruz chameleon i feel like my middle child is more compliant middle child tie
this reminds me more of a canfield nimble nine ride feel so interestingly enough i'm cleaning the tech climbs a little better
i feel like putting a little more power in reward to me a little more
i'm more tired but i'm sprinting up these more i'm in a harder gear than the first time around so weird how some bikes just have an attitude and they want to be ridden a certain way this one wants to race a little it still is a mile muncher it still wants to just be peddled all day long
interestingly enough i feel the stiffness in the front too not just in the back triangle
i feel it more at my hands than i thought i would kind of like the difference between the big owl and the big wig how the big l felt a little snappier and more eager to sprint i get that out of this tie one feels like i've got an extra four or five psi in my tires and some people are sensitive to that and some people are not yeah it's pretty fun it's got this energetic feel that the steel didn't quite have i think this would make an awesome single speed what a beautiful day it's so good to be out and about yeah this is noticeably stiffer than the steel one it's not just in my head
i'm feeling a lot more of the trail
so interesting
at first i wasn't sure if it was in my head it's definitely not
just has a totally different personality
this one's a little bit more serious
okay come on
this one climbs the chunk a little better i like that you can put a little more energy into this and it gives it back all right here comes the tricky spot
oh yeah yeah for some reason i climbed this one a little better than the steel one
almost feels like it has a slightly steeper seat angle but i know that's not true they're the same exact frame yeah my finger is feeling it just from all those micro vibrations man who would have guessed
really surprised me
both models handle extremely well and i find myself going a lot faster than most trail bikes like the sur9 or that sage power line or even the nimble9 just find myself charging into stuff faster and the bike will keep up which isn't usually the case for me on shorter reach bikes like this but that just goes to show that geometry is so much more than one or two measurements it's how everything plays together these sherpas have some great trail geo
yeah when i start to lose it in corners it drifts both wheels predictably it's really nice that little bit longer chains stay in shorter reach makes that happen
you're just in the center of the bike in this neutral position most of the time at least on a size 17 you can relax a lot more my upper body is less stretched out less tense than when i'm riding aggressive longer bikes but for most of the riding i do i think something like the switch niner is a better fit for my style for this stuff blues and greens long days bike packing maybe xc racing i think this is the bike to get someone once told me that when the tubes fit tighter and the welds are more precise a frame is stiffer i could see that and i wonder if the tolerances on these tubes are just so good at the miters where they all join that it adds a little bit of stiffness to it hello wonderful have a great day this bike seems to carry a little more momentum than the steel one but the seal one's a smoother ride this one just wants to keep you on cadence
almost feels like a carbon bike or an aluminum bike in some senses
my pinky's hurting quite a bit to manual so i'm going to save those for another day funny how much use your pinky it's not as playful as a chameleon or as a hanzo esd
reminds me a lot of the spot in its attitude how it can be ridden a lot harder than you think if i were racing xc i'd rather have the spot it's just more comfortable but it still has that same snappiness when you get on it but i understand a lot of people's hesitancy to go with a carbon frame especially on a hardtail there's something awesome about having a metal frame you don't worry about it as much
yeah this thing just begged you to shift to a harder gear and pedal a little bit harder so you can go faster on the flats really fun
this would be such a good single speed what a great ride this has been been fun having you along if you're new to the channel make sure you subscribe we love hardtails and talking about them and comparing them and getting experimental
been a pleasure having you along today let's summarize my thoughts this bike is raw and it's exciting because it's raw it's snappier it's zippier and i don't think it's the weight i think it's the tubing feel it actually feels a lot like some aluminum bikes in fact i think my banshee paradox v3 is a more comfortable ride than this that's not a bad thing necessarily but if you're looking for the most supple ride definitely go with the reynolds8531 it is significantly more supple that's my all-time favorite steel hardtail i've ever ridden this is still a fantastic hardtail it's beautifully built it's gorgeous it's snappy it's racier if i were racing xc this all day long if i were racing a two day bike packing race while this is lighter and racier i'd go for the reynolds steel one because it would beat me up less it's surprising how much my broken pinky is hurting right now maybe it's because it's the second ride of the day but i really think it's the stiffness of the frame it's not overly stiff like the common saw meta it's just not supple like the steel version of this which happens to be one of the most supple bikes i've ever ridden i prefer the reynolds 853 steel sherpa i don't mind a little extra weight and even if they were the same price i think i would still go for the reynolds one for what i like now i also own a spot rocker which covers a lot of the same territory as this which is a sprinty racy exciting zippy bike if i didn't own the rocker i still think i'd get the steel sherpa for myself i have lots of rocks here it's real chattery i will take a little bit loss of efficiency for more comfort if you live where there's tons of flow and not a lot of rocks and square edged hits i think most people are gonna prefer the taiwan it's lighter it's zippier it's snappier when you step on the gas it translates to more forward motion it's weird i never felt like the steel one was flexi or noodly but you definitely feel the power transfer difference on this this has been a fascinating experiment and i want you to be really careful when interpreting the results i'm not saying that all thai bikes feel like this and all steel bikes feel like the other one i am just comparing the uk reynolds 853 sherpa gen 3 that i have to the titanium sherpa tie made in taiwan and between those two this one's stiffer on my rsd middle child the titanium one is way more supple than the steel model and the steel model beat me up a lot more so it really depends on the bike and as much as we'd like to lump everything into these neat categories of steel versus tie versus aluminum if you need help consulting on your next hardtail and you're wondering which one to get or how bike a compares to bike b or you want to pick my brain on how these bikes compare i'd be happy to do that over on patreon i have a bike consultation service for people who are looking to buy their next bike but haven't been able to get out and ride 50 different hard tails like i have i'm not tied to any of these companies so it doesn't matter to me which one you get i just want to make sure you get the best bike for your riding terrain and your skill level and what you're looking for and i do that via patreon that's how i support my family that's how i'm able to do this full time for my job and i love doing it and i'm super grateful for dan and the team at stanton for sending me these two frames to be able to compare them so i'm curious if you were to buy one would you get the steel one or the tie one and why as always there's a party in the mountains and you're invited
in an ideal world i'd have enough of the same exact parts to build two of these up at once but i don't so we're gonna do the next best thing so we're gonna go take this for a ride on a trail i'm gonna run back to my shop put all the exact same parts on the tie frame and then same day go out and ride the same exact loop so it's still fresh in my mind so i can compare how the two feel it's not scientific but it's the best that i can do and i've been able to feel the difference back to back on other bikes hopefully i do on this as well i've previously reviewed this bike with 27.5 plus wheels on it but for today's ride i've made a few changes i've got 29ers on it i got my paul clamper mechanical disc brakes on here i've got my nuke proof horizon v3 29er wheels with specialized eliminator grid trail t7s up front in a 2.3 and specialized ground control grid in a 2 3 in the rear as well i like two threes more than two sixes i feel like they dig and bite and are a little more precise and and give the bike a snappier feel and a less vague feel i feel like if you're going to go plus go plus and go 2.8 to 3.0 let's get riding i'm glad i went with the 35 mil riser bars i like a taller stack some people like a more aggressive lower front end and for those of you that do you'd like less rise in your bars but this feels good for me with the 120 mil fork this bike has a super comfortable pedaling position i feel like stanton really knows their stuff keeping the reach compact on this bike for its intended use that makes a lot of sense i've had it on double black diamonds and it got a little out of its comfort zone especially on ledgie drops but for green and blue and black trails i think the geo's really good as i said in my other review this is my favorite riding steel frame i've ever ridden it's just a reminder that not all steel bites have to be over built burly enduro shredders restores my faith in bike builders they can still make light fun comfortable steel bikes and that's what this is this is such a good climber doesn't feel heavy my body's in a comfortable position i feel like i could ride all day like this what a fun riding experience what a beautiful day it's a joy to climb on this thing does not feel heavy in the slightest doesn't feel like my spot rocker that's super light but it doesn't feel heavy either surprisingly this bike rides equally well with 29ers or 27.5 plus a little quicker on 29ers overall speed wants to keep its momentum up but the geo doesn't feel like it's suited for one more than the other it's pretty middle of the road so if i were bike packing this i'd either throw 29 by two sixes on or 27.5 by 3.0 for trail riding i think it suits itself best as a 29er if you like higher speeds and you kind of want an xc race feel if you want to play around in monster truck and ride stuff that's a little bit gnarlier than it's intended for an underbike i think the 27.5 by 3.0 is the way to go but steering's calm with both cornering is great with both you can really run either one and for those wanting a mullet setup sure you could do it i don't think this is the right bike i feel like mullets really shine on fast downhill bikes i feel like if you want to maximize a mullet i'd get the stanton switch niner and mullet that and maybe run a 130 fork i'll bet that'd be really fun but do whatever you want you can always mull it any 29er bike it'll lower the bottom bracket a little make it a little slacker but with the range and bikes we've got right now where some bikes have a 30 mil bottom bracket drop and some have an 80. you don't need anything special to mull it just do it and experiment and see what you like and don't like borrow a buddies wheels and throw them on we don't have a lot of flow trails in sedona but this is one of them long canyon the dead man's this is dead man's right here
this bike is surprisingly playful when you've got a shorter reach you can get away with a longer chain stay to still have fun
a little bit slipperier out here today we got some fun trail conditions a lot of loose sand
this bike can charge pretty well though man it's comfortable
just real fun on greens and blues love this steel frame if i didn't know a tie frame existed i'd be thrilled with this but we always want better don't we and even knowing the tie frame exists i'd still be thrilled with this bike but i'm excited to see if i can feel that 1.7 pound difference between the two and if there's a different ride quality geo's exactly the same between the two
yeah i think 120 mil travel is perfect on this bike
and a lot of people are asking how does the fox step caps compare to the sid they're both fine the fox has a little more room for 27.5 plus that's why i have it on here i'd be just fine with either one so that was fun real comfortable a lot of people are in denial and think there's no such difference between a stiff hard tail and a harsh one because they don't want to hear that their model's harsh there's a huge difference and this is one of the most comfortable steel frames i've ever ridden it does beat out that johnny rotten i rode so many years ago all right now we come to the technical climbing section of this trail so as you know it's not my first choice for charging super big moves like where i broke my pinky let's see how it does with medium tech moves up here
here's the first one
didn't time that perfectly it worked normally i like a steeper seat tube and a longer reach but if it's going to have a shorter reach like this i like a slacker steep tube just like this and it works well
and i know that stanton knows their stuff oh i gotta concentrate here
redo don't judge the bike i was in the wrong gear
picked a better line oh yeah no problem it's a good comfy climber i think i'd keep 29ers on it almost all the time for how i'd intend to ride it it's kind of like a steel version of my spot rocker but the spot is noticeably lighter it accelerates faster
they're about the same comfort level but if you don't want a carbon frame or you want a bike pack and strap bags to it i think this is a great option be interesting to see how the taiwan one compares to the reynolds eight five three one i'll bet they'd be more similar than different dan says the weight is pretty similar so how does this bike compare to other bikes in the same category xc slash trail bikes it's not as fast and energetic as the spot rocker there's a little bit more excitement to the ride on the rocker this is a little bit more common subdued i think this is the bike that most people who've been riding older bikes it's the most modern bike that they'll feel comfortable on without having to change much in their riding style surprisingly i like this more than some tie frames i like it more than the sage power line it's not quite as zippy and snappy and light feeling but it is more comfortable it feels a lot like my rsd middle child tie it's maybe even slightly softer the geo's very different from the middle child though middle child's much more of a bruiser attack charger enduro double black diamond type bike i like this a lot more than the nine or sir nine it's more supple than the niner more modern riding position less twitchy old school xc racers are gonna like the niner a little more because this is slacker than the niner this would be a great bike for someone with a full suspension for big days but then they want a fun comfortable little bike for the green and blue trails near them or for bike packing i prefer this bike over the sage flow motion though they have different intentions
i feel like i can actually ride this about as aggressively as the sage flow motion despite being less travel and a little bit less aggressive geo on paper oh i do struggle on these big power moves on this bike with that shorter reach i do not feel hunched over which i really like i think if this was my only bike i'd get used to it more and be able to climb techy climbs better look at these beautiful green ocotillo such a smooth quiet bike
your weight's really balanced between front and back on this thing you don't have to get over the front so much because you're already over it because it's a little shorter
oh almost crashed
i still have a broken finger the doctor said i can ride i'm just not allowed to crash so i'm taking it easy so i want to be real clear i'm comparing one steel frame to one tie frame we can't assume that every tie frame and every steel frame will compare like these two do so much goes into a frame more than the material and i'm always reluctant to make these videos because someone's gonna come away from it and say oh i can buy a chinese frame for 1200 bucks at titanium it's gonna ride better than every steel frame or vice versa we don't know that gotta factor in tubing thickness and size and junctions and geometry there's so much at play here so be very careful with over generalizations that said i'm super grateful for stanton for sending these in for this experiment i can't wait this bike and the spot rocker are two of my favorites for flow trails if you want to see what steel is reel is all about to see if you can feel the difference between steel hardtails this is the one to do it on some steel bikes ride harsher than aluminum this bike has that famous steel is real feel it's amazing how good it feels and it's amazing how bad some other steel frames feel this bike is such a great bike for just putting down the miles i like it with 29ers feels a little more efficient feels a little more playful and rowdy with 27.5 plus but yeah even with two three tires it's a comfy frame i know i keep saying that but it's significantly more comfortable than most steel bikes more comfy than the nimble9 much more comfy than the rsd middle child steel or rc291 and it should be it's got a different intention not meant for hucking or rowdy big stuff so it can be built a little lighter because it doesn't have to endure the massive forces you'd see on an enduro bike which gives it that nice nice feel feels a lot like that johnny rotten but with better geo much slacker head angle you can attack stuff way harder see i even know this is a little shorter reach it's more aggressive than a chameleon i feel like i can ride it harder than a chameleon i feel like the chameleon's a little zippier a little quicker on the acceleration
oh what a joy this bike loves to pedal it's so happy when you're pedaling
it also loves to fly down stuff way faster than you think it should
all right let's wrap this up as you know i love the feel of this bike it feels amazing feels better than a lot of thai bikes i've been on now i'm headed to the shop i'm going to swap every single part on this straight onto the tie one come back out here in a couple hours and ride the same exact loop and explain the differences in the ride feel hopefully that gave you a great baseline of what this amazing bike is like the thai bike has some big shoes to fill and it's going to be real hard to beat this ride quality but if it has the same ride quality and it's lighter that's going to be pretty special all right it's been a few hours and we're back with the stanton sherpa tie so everything swapped over identical except for the seat post this has the larger seat post the steel one just has the 30.9 this is the 31.6 i think it is so i had to swap seat posts that's the only thing that's different and even though the frame was 1.69 pounds lighter the complete bike was only 1.3 pounds lighter i don't know where i lost that other 0.39 pounds one thing i forgot to mention in my first look video where i compare this to the steel frame i messed up this is not a uk tie frame i thought it was they made about a hundred of them and then they decided to move production to taiwan so that they could get the quality and the speed and the quantity that they needed there's a lot of demand for these and they couldn't keep up with it in the uk so this frame i emailed dan and said dan do i have a taiwan one or a uk one and we checked the serial number and he said you have a taiwan one that could be why the welds look so amazing this is built by one of the best builders in the world who's in taiwan there's a couple other companies that have some great builders in taiwan and i've been very very impressed with them it's still built to stanton's tubing parameters and specs and angles and all that it's just not stanton doing the welding so i'm actually excited that my version is the same one that you'll get if you get a tie one so two more things i need to point out on the difference between the steel and the tie one on the thai ones we've got these little ports that have the bolt and they come in on the bottom of the down tube on the steel one it comes in the top and it's just a little hole and we feed it through and they still pop out down here in the same place but they enter in a different place personally i like the steel routing more that because this is going to rub the crown of my fork what i'd really love is a little window right here to run it in the side because then my cable routing would be nice and pretty and go in the side one other thing you'll notice this has a front derailleur cable hanger in case you wanted to run one apart from that they're pretty much identical other than where they're welded so you know i love the mint green one but dang this is amazing stanton anodized their logo there before bead blasting it it looks absolutely amazing this is probably the most beautiful tie bike i've ever ridden let's see how it rides that's really all that matters who cares how pretty it is if it doesn't ride great judging by the other stands i've ridden i think this is going to be pretty cool so i'm going to ride the same exact route i rode earlier this morning on the steel one maybe it's the extra chain lube i put on maybe i put on 0.39 pounds of chain lube that would be a lot 1.3 pounds is noticeable although i will say running super light wheels would make more of a difference than a super light frame on the climbs this frame feels a little snappier i don't know if it's stiffer or just because it's lighter it accelerates faster it's a little more energetic a little less laid back a little bit racier feeling feels like i can push one gear harder at the same effort of the other one yeah this bike wants to attack a little bit more i think it might be stiffer we'll have to see on the downhill under sprinting it does feel slightly stiffer which is when you want a stiff bike when you're putting power down reminds me a little bit more of the spot rocker with that little bit um with that little snappier acceleration i like it yeah i should be more tired because this is my second ride of the day but i actually feel good and a little more energetic i'm willing to push it a little more interesting the other one didn't feel slow at all this one just has a snappier feel oh man i can't believe we're here already that climb went by really fast i'm impressed with these clampers on here and these wheels i added a good amount of weight to the bike coming in about 27 and a half pounds so that was pretty interesting and unexpected i did not expect it to feel zippier i expected it to feel a little lighter but not it almost felt more efficient almost like under sprinting it delivered power a little bit better and didn't flex quite as much the other one wasn't a noodle at all and maybe it's just the weight thing but it's hotter i'm more tired it's been a longer day i've been working all day i shouldn't feel more energetic yet here i am and while 1.3 pounds is noticeable it's not like night and day so i'm thinking it might have something more to do with the stiffness of the frame let's find out though we're about to take it on some downhill fun flow then some more technical climbs see what it feels like as i ride it so this is just seed of the pants this is not scientific
even though these paul clampers are a little heavier man i'll take that weight i love these things got them on three of my bikes now i bought two more sets myself after my review set i love them sounds a really nice quiet ride it is a little stiffer i did not expect that my broken finger a little more sensitive to jar jarring stuff howdy ooh very interesting yeah the rear triangle just feels slightly stiffer the front as well i get a little more vibration this feels a lot like my banshee paradox
stiffness wise
yeah my broken fingers feeling that that's really interesting all right that's so funny because on the rsd middle child the tie frame is way more supple than the steel one and on this bike the steel one feels more supple than this thai one this is still a great bike and i think if i were racing xc or long distance i think this would be a great one for bike packing it's probably a wash because once you load this up with 20 pounds of gear it's going to ride supple like the steel one oh now i'm curious to try a taiwan 4131 versus the reynolds 853 and see if the reynolds really makes a difference wow this is totally not what i was expecting i was expecting ride field to be pretty much the same as the steel all right technical climb challenge
it gets out of its own way a little bit quicker and i honestly think it's more the stiffness than the weight
and i want to be real careful you don't misunderstand stiffness this feels like a big owl or my paradox or santa cruz chameleon i feel like my middle child is more compliant middle child tie
this reminds me more of a canfield nimble nine ride feel so interestingly enough i'm cleaning the tech climbs a little better
i feel like putting a little more power in reward to me a little more
i'm more tired but i'm sprinting up these more i'm in a harder gear than the first time around so weird how some bikes just have an attitude and they want to be ridden a certain way this one wants to race a little it still is a mile muncher it still wants to just be peddled all day long
interestingly enough i feel the stiffness in the front too not just in the back triangle
i feel it more at my hands than i thought i would kind of like the difference between the big owl and the big wig how the big l felt a little snappier and more eager to sprint i get that out of this tie one feels like i've got an extra four or five psi in my tires and some people are sensitive to that and some people are not yeah it's pretty fun it's got this energetic feel that the steel didn't quite have i think this would make an awesome single speed what a beautiful day it's so good to be out and about yeah this is noticeably stiffer than the steel one it's not just in my head
i'm feeling a lot more of the trail
so interesting
at first i wasn't sure if it was in my head it's definitely not
just has a totally different personality
this one's a little bit more serious
okay come on
this one climbs the chunk a little better i like that you can put a little more energy into this and it gives it back all right here comes the tricky spot
oh yeah yeah for some reason i climbed this one a little better than the steel one
almost feels like it has a slightly steeper seat angle but i know that's not true they're the same exact frame yeah my finger is feeling it just from all those micro vibrations man who would have guessed
really surprised me
both models handle extremely well and i find myself going a lot faster than most trail bikes like the sur9 or that sage power line or even the nimble9 just find myself charging into stuff faster and the bike will keep up which isn't usually the case for me on shorter reach bikes like this but that just goes to show that geometry is so much more than one or two measurements it's how everything plays together these sherpas have some great trail geo
yeah when i start to lose it in corners it drifts both wheels predictably it's really nice that little bit longer chains stay in shorter reach makes that happen
you're just in the center of the bike in this neutral position most of the time at least on a size 17 you can relax a lot more my upper body is less stretched out less tense than when i'm riding aggressive longer bikes but for most of the riding i do i think something like the switch niner is a better fit for my style for this stuff blues and greens long days bike packing maybe xc racing i think this is the bike to get someone once told me that when the tubes fit tighter and the welds are more precise a frame is stiffer i could see that and i wonder if the tolerances on these tubes are just so good at the miters where they all join that it adds a little bit of stiffness to it hello wonderful have a great day this bike seems to carry a little more momentum than the steel one but the seal one's a smoother ride this one just wants to keep you on cadence
almost feels like a carbon bike or an aluminum bike in some senses
my pinky's hurting quite a bit to manual so i'm going to save those for another day funny how much use your pinky it's not as playful as a chameleon or as a hanzo esd
reminds me a lot of the spot in its attitude how it can be ridden a lot harder than you think if i were racing xc i'd rather have the spot it's just more comfortable but it still has that same snappiness when you get on it but i understand a lot of people's hesitancy to go with a carbon frame especially on a hardtail there's something awesome about having a metal frame you don't worry about it as much
yeah this thing just begged you to shift to a harder gear and pedal a little bit harder so you can go faster on the flats really fun
this would be such a good single speed what a great ride this has been been fun having you along if you're new to the channel make sure you subscribe we love hardtails and talking about them and comparing them and getting experimental
been a pleasure having you along today let's summarize my thoughts this bike is raw and it's exciting because it's raw it's snappier it's zippier and i don't think it's the weight i think it's the tubing feel it actually feels a lot like some aluminum bikes in fact i think my banshee paradox v3 is a more comfortable ride than this that's not a bad thing necessarily but if you're looking for the most supple ride definitely go with the reynolds8531 it is significantly more supple that's my all-time favorite steel hardtail i've ever ridden this is still a fantastic hardtail it's beautifully built it's gorgeous it's snappy it's racier if i were racing xc this all day long if i were racing a two day bike packing race while this is lighter and racier i'd go for the reynolds steel one because it would beat me up less it's surprising how much my broken pinky is hurting right now maybe it's because it's the second ride of the day but i really think it's the stiffness of the frame it's not overly stiff like the common saw meta it's just not supple like the steel version of this which happens to be one of the most supple bikes i've ever ridden i prefer the reynolds 853 steel sherpa i don't mind a little extra weight and even if they were the same price i think i would still go for the reynolds one for what i like now i also own a spot rocker which covers a lot of the same territory as this which is a sprinty racy exciting zippy bike if i didn't own the rocker i still think i'd get the steel sherpa for myself i have lots of rocks here it's real chattery i will take a little bit loss of efficiency for more comfort if you live where there's tons of flow and not a lot of rocks and square edged hits i think most people are gonna prefer the taiwan it's lighter it's zippier it's snappier when you step on the gas it translates to more forward motion it's weird i never felt like the steel one was flexi or noodly but you definitely feel the power transfer difference on this this has been a fascinating experiment and i want you to be really careful when interpreting the results i'm not saying that all thai bikes feel like this and all steel bikes feel like the other one i am just comparing the uk reynolds 853 sherpa gen 3 that i have to the titanium sherpa tie made in taiwan and between those two this one's stiffer on my rsd middle child the titanium one is way more supple than the steel model and the steel model beat me up a lot more so it really depends on the bike and as much as we'd like to lump everything into these neat categories of steel versus tie versus aluminum if you need help consulting on your next hardtail and you're wondering which one to get or how bike a compares to bike b or you want to pick my brain on how these bikes compare i'd be happy to do that over on patreon i have a bike consultation service for people who are looking to buy their next bike but haven't been able to get out and ride 50 different hard tails like i have i'm not tied to any of these companies so it doesn't matter to me which one you get i just want to make sure you get the best bike for your riding terrain and your skill level and what you're looking for and i do that via patreon that's how i support my family that's how i'm able to do this full time for my job and i love doing it and i'm super grateful for dan and the team at stanton for sending me these two frames to be able to compare them so i'm curious if you were to buy one would you get the steel one or the tie one and why as always there's a party in the mountains and you're invited
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